Abraham Palma

Joseph Lofthouse wrote:
Plants that really thrive in my ecosystem taste much better than those that struggle to survive.

Gotcha! So even if I cannot taste it, just by selecting plants that thrive, it improves.

I've bought eight radishes varieties from a portuguese seed company, hope they are open-pollinated, to be planted in october when rainy season should start, even if the last three years we haven't had any rains of value in Automn. (it still rains well in Spring, but less frequently. Growth is slow in Winter).
I'm gonna try this method: dig a 10-15cm hole, fill it with home-made compost (kitchen scraps + cardboards + a bit of dirt from the land), and seed a bunch of seeds per hole, to be trimmed once they sprout. No watering, no extra fertilization. Maybe adding some wild brassica roots for extra microbs.

Hehe, I wouldn't mind to crouch and bite, but I was thinking on using a small knife to cut a bite without taking the plant, just to increase the chance of survival.

Thanks, Christopher. They are fast growers, and that's what encourages me to try it. We don't have many rainy days, but it sometimes happens.

Hi there!

I want to try this landracing gardening for developing dry farming varieties in the mediterranean. I thought radishes would work well because they grow so fast that they can produce a yield with just a couple of rainy weeks.
However, how can I check the crop is fine (I prefer it less spicy) without ruining the seeds?
In a previous comment it says taking the shoulder and replanting. Is it possible to take a bite from the root without harvesting it? Would this work with carrots too? They don't taste the same near the leaves than under the bulb.

Also, you are giving me two good ideas.

First is to take an insurance before taking a big job.
Second is to start small, more hours and lower billing until I have the experience for the high end clients.

Samuel Billings wrote:Hi Abraham!

I just typed out a giant reply to this thread at 3am because I couldn’t sleep.

So this is the abridged version #2 of what was once a much longer reply:

I’ve been in the field for 20 years or so in one form or another and I came here because I am toying with the idea of my own gardening company.

From the best possible place: I don’t think you are ready.

Confidence and knowledge in sales is the entire business. You can only get there when you really know your stuff on the horticulture side. High-end clientele can smell bs a mile away. And yes, you need at least fairly high-end clientele. Unless you want to do high-volume (which is much worse imho), you won’t be able to make a living.

You would do well to work for someone else for a few years and lower your expectation of what permaculture is. A truck backs up the same way on a permaculture landscape as it does on a conventional one. You can still be ethical and regenerative while learning from people and working places that may be slightly less so, at least until you’ve built up your skills and your wallet enough. It takes money to start a business, don’t let anyone to you otherwise. Very few people can bootstrap themselves into a living. Especially if you don’t have a lot of prior knowledge or extreme luck. Ever do a big warranty project because you messed up while someone was paying you? I have. It can put you straight into a big hole.

Also, in response to some of the things others said in this thread: putting random organic matter onto the soil is not a good way to go. And composting other people’s waste is terrible advice!  That is its own business in and of itself and requires space and equipment.

Please know that I fully support the idea if you do try to do it: I’m not a naysayer. I have just started my own business before and failed because I wasn’t ready and wouldn’t want someone else to do that, too. Especially if your family doesn’t agree! Did I read that part right? That’s a hard stop, too.

Anyway, happy to discuss more if you like. You can also tell me to screw and I won’t be offended.

…I guess version 2 reply wasn’t so short either.

Hello, Samuel.

First, be welcomed to permies, the best forum for homesteaders.
Next, I want to thank you. It's not easy to express disagreement, and your answer really deserves to be thought about.
There are a few keystones in my path that are suggesting me to continue, though.

I've been in a career orientation course, and it has helped me to focus my project. So far, I'm doing rather small steps, but it works well for me for several reasons, one of them is that I have time for studying. My family is getting used to the idea, and is now offering constructive criticism. I showed my wife real numbers, and is getting convinced that we are not going to starve. I have some money for the moment, enough for a couple of years. I am learning that there are some incentives for starting a new bussiness: low taxing for the first two years, and some extra money for the start.
I've started working at a small garden: I listen to the client preferences and try to include ecological practices in areas where he doesn't mind. He agreed to have a compost pile and adding some clover to his bermuda grass, for example. He seems happy with the results, and is asking me to go more frequently. It's just three hours a week, but it's enough to get the practice that I need.
At the same time, I've met a couple of ecological gardeners who are enthusiastic about my project and are giving me very valuable advices. They've also pointed me to an ecological nursery that has recently opened in the area (only six months since they went fully ecological). The nursery doesn't have many plants yet, but what they have is excellent.
I've purchased some manual tools with what I earned working. A friend borrows me her minivan in case I need it, but so far I didn't need it, cause most of the things that are bought in bulk is carried by the seller.
Another friend who has a renovation company is passing me new clients.
In the orientation course, they've allowed me to open a xerogarden and advertise me (I pay the installation, they allow me to advertise for one year). The placement is excellent, since it's in a very busy street.

There are some many locks that are unlocking themselves, that I can't help but think that the universe wants me just here. That I have to fail and learn, it's something I try to remember. One big failure I made two weeks ago when I ordered what I thought it was 1000 m3 of substrate (vegetal earth it is called) but it was 70% dirt with 30% compost, and it took me almost eight hours carrying loads of earth by hand climbing a two stories staircase. Lesson learned.

Hello,
I'd like to share the word of this practice among some market gardeners friends of mine. Is it OK to credit Joseph Lofthouse for the practice, or should I mention other authors?

I am joining in.

I still do not have a good land and spare time for landracing, but I certainly want to know how to do it, just for when the occasion arises.

Mike Philips wrote:

Abraham Palma wrote:Native plants are your best bet.

…

You need a species that is adapted to the way it rains in your location.

If natives are “best”, why are non-natives sometimes better?  

I think natives are easier because they are adapted to local conditions: climate, flora, fauna, microbes...
Sometimes these ecosystems are so badly degraded that a foreign species can thrive without competition.
Sometimes it's the climate that's changing, and natives are no better adapted than foreigners.
Sometimes it's us who are giving the plants a non-native environment by the way of fertilizing and irrigating.

An example. Subtropical plants grow very fast, compared to mediterranean species. If we plant subtropicals here (I'm in a mediterranean climate) and give them enough water, they outcompete the mediterranean ones. But if we can't keep the irrigation going on, those subtropicals suffer or die and it's the mediterranean ones who stand. For the same reason, if you plant a mediterranean slow growing species in a subtropical climate, you need to keep its competion out or it gets overwhelmed by the natives.

Another example. Foreign palm trees were planted massively in our coasts. The only native palm tree here is the chamaerops nobilis, a small bushy palm tree with an edible trunk. For more than 60 years they've thriven. Now, a carabid is damaging them all and there's no natural predator here against the carabid, so they are fighting the 'plague' with massive fumigations and hormone inyections and whatever they fancy. They are throwing money with no end at sight at a problem they've caused by massively introducing a foreign species.

Using a foreign species is sensible when it's a transitional phase, or in a controlled manner (small quantities, confined spaces, market gardens, ...)

There are also reasons for using non natives: better taste, better shape. Most of what we eat is not native, it's food that was brought from Asia and adapted to be grown here. It was done by skilled farmers. So, if you know what you are doing, then yes, you could go for the non natives and have success.

Yes, it works better from outside this website.

I do continuous composting in bins,
does it count as cold piles?